Green Tea Forum

Photiou · Posted: Apr 26, 2007 8:20 am Post subject: Visual estimation of sencha quality

I was just thinking about this:
How could one visually estimate the quality of sencha?
What properties should be looked on tea leaves, in a final cup of tea or in used tea leaves?
I think color have been listed as one, but are there any other visual clues??

Ryan · Sensei Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 475

Interesting question...

In my opinion (Though I really have no idea) there isn't any way at all to do that. I've had sencha's that have varied from in tact leaf (as much as a sencha can have) to tea's like Yutaka Midori which aren't very in tact but you could spend decades looking for Japanese green tea that offers the same quality in flavor and aroma...

And in terms of color of the liquor, my opinion is that this is subjective.. Granted, it's a major plus to see a beautiful liquor such as that Yutaka Midori produces, but ultimately the color of the water does not dictate how good the tea will taste (so I assume). Some Japanese tea's have a more yellowish color in the liquor and yet are of very high quality.

Chip · Posted: Apr 26, 2007 10:07 am Post subject:

While I agree with Ryan completely..for mere mortals such as us, In many purchasing venues in Japan, I know of one in Kagoshima, they are able to view dry and wet leaf as well as the brew itself. But it is all hands off. The one picture I saw, there must have been several hundred different sencha all lined up for buyers to view. I think that would be an impossible task to pick a few good sencha under those conditions...in fact I would go crazy trying.

The author went on to say that even a seasoned buyer usually goes to the sellers a few days ahead of time to gain an edge over the other buyers.

Interestingly enough, all the teas were measured and brewed automatically so all were brewed with the exact same parameters.

spacesamurai · 2nd Degree Black Belt Joined: 02 Feb 2007 Posts: 204

okay, you all keep talking about it. I'm going to have to try some Yutaka Midori.

Photiou · Posted: Apr 27, 2007 5:35 am Post subject:

Hmph... quick look around with google did get few interesting results, seems at least shape, gloss and color can be compared.

Shape:
- uniformity -> good
- there are two leaf types, needle-type and 'eye brow'/comma-type Question

Gloss:
- is high gloss better? One page described their product as 'black shine as needles'.

Color of tea leaves:
- deep or bright green (this can be actually quite easily to be seen as some _very_ old secha I have is turning gray).

Color of the water:
- yellow color / golden yellow (quite interesting, no references to green color Exclamation

)

There seems to be tea competitions, anyone know how competition teas are graded?

Edit: the yellow color was said to relate to 'hand-rubbing' and in one page they deliberately attacked notion 'greener the better' and said uji-tea is yellow Question

.

Kevangogh · Forum God Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 916 Location: Japan

Uji green tea is not supposed to be yellow - wrong. Plus, there is virtually no Japanese green tea which is hand-rubbed anymore.

There is one supplier here in Japan who submitted their green teas to an international competition in Belgium and won a gold prize. We were asked to submit our green teas as well but I declined. Why? They wanted $2,000 entry fee. This obviously is a money making scheme. For that kind of money, I want to know who the renowned experts are in Belgium that are qualified to judge Japanese green tea. So now I have seen this green tea on various other vendor's sites trumpeting that their green tea as a gold prize winner. I had a sample of this green tea - it was pretty good, but it wouldn't beat our Hatsumi.

It's true; you can't always go by the color as there are some really good green teas which are more yellow than others. I do think, from a consumer point of view, a good rule of thumb to follow would be the greener the better. Good green tea should be "green" to some extent, not yellow. Most of the "green teas" out there that are yellow are that way because not fresh. Our Miyabi is more yellow that Yutaka midori but the quality is comparable.

syntheticpanda · 2nd Degree Black Belt Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 198

I have heard that high quality Long Jing brews a yellow color, but that's Chinese not Japanese, so it's comparing apples and oranges. I would defer to Kevin on this, he has seen far more Japanese green tea than most of us could ever hope to.

Photiou · Posted: Apr 27, 2007 6:35 pm Post subject:

Kevangogh · Forum God Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 916 Location: Japan

I don't sell yellow green tea, and I also won't pay $2000 for a fake gold medal, regardless of how much it brings in. The bottom line is whether the tea is "really" any good and trust me, there are plenty of customers here who know. That's my ROI.

Photiou · Posted: Apr 28, 2007 6:21 am Post subject:

Ryan · Sensei Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 475

The Miyabi is not as green (in some ways) across the board as say the Yutaka Midori or the Kabusecha is... However, it still has a green overall appeal to me. And in fact, I find the color of the Miyabi truly vibrant and inspiring. Even Sencha's that do have some yellow in the liquor, this can't compare to the yellowish tone that Chinese green tea often has. I would consider the yellowish tone that Japanese green tea sometimes has to be much more vibrant and illuminating (and closer to green) than the yellowish character that Chinese green tea often has, if that makes any sense.

After trying many vendors specializing in Japanese green tea, Miyabi stands out among them all.

Photiou · Posted: Apr 28, 2007 6:53 am Post subject:

One problem when comparing color is that lighting has a large effect on that. But compared to gyokuro or Yutaka Midori the color was more yellow/or more like yellow-greenish - at least in my kitchen.

Photiou · Posted: Apr 28, 2007 7:25 am Post subject:

Some more googling and I found these definitions.
Stems are easier to notice from wet leaves I think, so on that 'tea market' one could compare wet leaves for that purpose (just guessing).

Chip · Posted: Apr 28, 2007 7:30 am Post subject:

Welcome to the forum, Photiou. My experiences with some sencha found at O-Cha.

Dry leaf...
Gyo: very dark green
Yutaki: dark green
Miyabi: very green
Hatsumi: ligher green
Chinese green: variable

Brewed...
Gyo: very green through the first 3 or so steeps
Yutaki: greenish first steep, very very green 2nd steep, still green 3rd steep
Miyabi: Yellowish green first steep, very green 2nd, greenish 3rd
Hatsumi: lighter yellowish green 1st, more greenish 2nd, light greenish yellow 3rd.
Chinese: mostly yellow brews and never green like first flush sencha

The Yutaki is the richest green of the sencha, while I think the Miyabi, especially 2nd steep, is so irridescent, like radioactive water it almost glows in my glass serving pitcher, amazing apperarence. I have never seen sencha with such beautiful color...PERIOD.

However, while appearence is nice, it is the flavor that really sets these sencha apart. To focus too much attention on the appearence takes away from their great flavors and aromas. This is more important.

So, yes my first impression is appearence of the dry leaf, its aroma dry and when it is in a preheated pot waiting for hot water...smell the leaf at this point, wow. Then comes aroma as it brews and after brewing....and finally flavor. A great sencha has to score well on all these points to win favor with the ultimate judges...US, THE END CONSUMER.

I hope this helps.

Photiou · Posted: Apr 28, 2007 9:18 am Post subject: